New Players and Experienced Players ATTITUDES

Canuck · Post by **Canuck** » Wed Mar 30, 2005 7:36 pm

Recently I have come across a group of new Descent/Online players, some of them decide to stick it out and learn, without attitude, cussing, and always a laugh or silly comment at the death they just had. Those are the pilots I invite to Rangers after gettting to know them for a while.

I remember first joining Kali Min 3 online after playing D1 on LAN exclusively. What a mind bender of an experience that was. Lag? Loss?

Wow surviving 3-10 seconds was a goal there for a while.

After a while though I was feeling that I was doing better being able to last onwards of a minute.

I think I joined an expert game that first game as well... every spawn point and door had mines or a pyro,

or somehow I'd manage to wander right into the dogging room with 3 pyros engaged in a six degree ballet of destruction, my life ended usually with me being used to re-arm one of the other pilots so he could go on dogging buddy.

I was a mere bug splat on many pilots windshields let me tell you. Often I'd find all the juicy weapons with like 4 shields or something so I was sought after.

One thing over the years I've learned though is to offer respect and sportsmanship before crude words.

Berating a lower skilled player is low in my books... but unfortunately there are those out there that do it.

They lack honour, skill and are nothing but bullies, usually they are afraid, and cowards, also one other thing and it's a Universal truth to the matter, is that they never last.

Good natured jibbing is OK in my books and if "typed" in the spirit of fun but not ridicule, at least to me, it is just a way to have fun and this is just one part of Descent that I'd like to promote to as many new players as I can.

To those players that join then leave after being killed 5 times in a row, come out 50 more times if you have to, twisting and firing... but if you stick with it you WILL get better.

Also just ask for tips when the opportunity arises.
Many good Descent players will take the time if they can to help you learn some new tricks and stategies that will help you survive a bit longer in games.

Also try and figure out how the opponent just killed you... try and learn or make a defense to it.
Every death has a tale as well as victory.

Anyways new pilots;

Snotty elitist attitudes, whining, and constant accusations of cheating are sometimes part of the game at times, I usually like to goad the callers,

but other times require more blunt approaches, its like trying to talk to a tree, tranqued up rodeo stars, or dirt, you get the picture.

Try and not let them get you typing... actually I would rather promote you using the time typed to fly around and look for keyboards.

Now start firing, he can still type when hes dead, but it just comes with it's own shovel anyways.

Ok next is to figure out where he respawns next

Rinse and repeat.

Krom · Post by **Krom** » Wed Mar 30, 2005 8:11 pm

What was that all about? Anyone care to translate?

TheCops · Post by **TheCops** » Wed Mar 30, 2005 8:23 pm

self deprication was always my strong suit... and you could have prolly emailed this to the remaining descent 3 players.

;-0

CDN_Merlin · Post by **CDN_Merlin** » Wed Mar 30, 2005 9:30 pm

I played D3 2 night ago with Buck Rogers in AA and was accused of cheating. This is the 1st time in about 8 months that I've played. I was winning 12-1 or something like that when he accused me in not so many words. I explained to him that his shots were missing but also that the level had TONS of shield orbs floating and that I would just go pick some up and be at 200 shields everytime we met.

He ended up staying til it got to about 20-2 then left. I'm sure he still thinks I was cheating.

Clayman · Post by **Clayman** » Thu Mar 31, 2005 12:21 am

Unfortunately, it seems that most pilots who think others cheat, or whine frequently cannot be helped. They tend to be stuck in their ways, and it is rare for them to change (unless they are not yet adults). So a lot of this is preaching to the choir.

Sirius · Post by **Sirius** » Thu Mar 31, 2005 12:24 am

Believe you me, this ain't the only game where it happens. There are always the people who can't seem to comprehend the fact that they can lose pretty badly to other people sometimes.

Canuck · Post by **Canuck** » Thu Mar 31, 2005 12:38 am

What are some good tactics that you use to try and defuse, (or inflate if you have some interesting ones!) these accusations?

Also it's interesting to note that its just not the Descent series of games that breeds this reaction from some.

Since I only dabble in other games I havent been exposed to as much variety of negativity.

I try and reason with the other pilot, but if they refuse to even say maybe... I either goad them or remain silent.

Usually the silent treatment brings an escalating rise of hilarity scrolling across the HUD, however goading has it's merits as well.

kurupt · Post by **kurupt** » Thu Mar 31, 2005 12:51 am

i prefer to taunt people who insist on being jackasses. taunting can have many definitions, and with me its rarely in the form of typing (in game at least.)

what i do is play with them awhile, especially if they are unskilled. let them run out of energy firing at me and swoop in for a quick kill. or maybe i'll single them out and make sure the game has lost all its fun for them.

or maybe i'll see them in a game from the browser and i'll join it just to run them out. most of the time people can handle everything you say or do, except losing. nobody likes to lose. so thats what i do, i make them lose over and over again until they leave. and when they do, i join the game and make them lose again. eventually they stop being jackasses, or they just leave a game as soon as i enter it.

then theres the rare breed who can lose repeatedly, call you a hack, and storm out of the game. then 2 days later they dont remember recieving the asskicking you doled out to them and they spount off at the mouth again. then you beat them again. and again. then after awhile they just stop playing you but still keep talking ★■◆●. i like to call these people "candyass" or "redbone."

at least, thats what i did when i played.

Top Gun · Post by **Top Gun** » Thu Mar 31, 2005 1:38 am

Some people are just plain ***holes who deserve a good smack upside the head. You just have to learn to ignore them (or better yet, irritate the hell out of them

) and have fun with the people who actually enjoy playing the game and gaining experience.

Cangaceiro · Post by **Cangaceiro** » Thu Mar 31, 2005 6:06 am

CDN_Merlin wrote:I played D3 2 night ago with Buck Rogers in AA and was accused of cheating. This is the 1st time in about 8 months that I've played. I was winning 12-1 or something like that when he accused me in not so many words. I explained to him that his shots were missing but also that the level had TONS of shield orbs floating and that I would just go pick some up and be at 200 shields everytime we met.

He ended up staying til it got to about 20-2 then left. I'm sure he still thinks I was cheating.

All I said was "Something is not right" is that accusing someone of cheating. Gime a a break will u. BTW I let u spawn clean when a I had u in clear view. A chance that I never got from u. I will see you around. we will see then.

WarAdvocat · Post by **WarAdvocat** » Thu Mar 31, 2005 7:47 am

Definition of "Spawn Clean": To spawn, in Descent 3, with 2 seconds of invulnerability, Blue Lasers & 6 Concussion missiles.

Definition of "Whiner": Anyone who thinks that the above is incorrect.

Aside from that lil distinction, I try to have fun.

CDN_Merlin · Post by **CDN_Merlin** » Thu Mar 31, 2005 8:21 am

Spawn clean? I don't remember shooting you at the instant you spawned.

And as for "something is not right", WTF you think that implies? Implies you are thinking I'm cheating because I'm whooping your ass so bad.

Most times I try to educate the user on lag/loss and and differences with them but some people think if your ping is low, you an't be to blame (cause they don't knwo what loss is).

Krom · Post by **Krom** » Thu Mar 31, 2005 9:58 am

WarAdvocat wrote:2 seconds of invulnerability

2 seconds to charge trifusion too. =)

Canuck · Post by **Canuck** » Thu Mar 31, 2005 1:35 pm

Hehe I had a pilot screech at me to stop using "insert weapon here". So I type back which version of death does he prefer?

Spawn killing... perfectly legal in a game called anarchy in my books. You spawn with a full load of missles, an afterburner, invunerability, and lasers.

Learn to use them, and learn to fly faster.
It takes a while to nibble at a tanks shields with blues... but it can be done. Try killing the spawn camper before you invunerability wears off... or vamoose!

Camping spew, hey the thief bot does it.

Typekilling... well I generally dont look for keyboards to target but many pilots will, so be aware type with care

As for whining, look for "Whinearchy" games in the server list next time you want play a game.

My 2Â¢

Lothar · Post by **Lothar** » Thu Mar 31, 2005 2:57 pm

CDN_Merlin wrote:And as for "something is not right", WTF you think that implies? Implies you are thinking I'm cheating....

Sometimes it implies "my controller is all f***ed up" (I've used it that way this week) or "the server / ping is strange" (fairly common complaint.)

CDN_Merlin · Post by **CDN_Merlin** » Thu Mar 31, 2005 3:37 pm

If the score is 10-8, sure, but when the score is 10-0, the implication is cheating.

Lothar · Post by **Lothar** » Thu Mar 31, 2005 4:52 pm

Not necessarily, no. The implication could be that their controller and/or connect is messed up enough that it's 10-0 instead of 10-2, and they can tell that something isn't right. If you think it's an accusation, ask them directly -- what are you trying to imply?

Speaking of attitudes... some people are far too quick to accuse others of cheating, and others are far too quick to take any "hmmm" or "strange" comment as an accusation.

CDN_Merlin · Post by **CDN_Merlin** » Thu Mar 31, 2005 5:38 pm

Lothar, everytime someone has gone "hmm" to me in D3, they have accused me of cheating after I asked them if that is what they meant. So when someone says "hmm somethings strange" I take it as an accusation that they think I cheat.

ArcherOmega · Post by **ArcherOmega** » Thu Mar 31, 2005 6:05 pm

â??Newâ?

Krom · Post by **Krom** » Thu Mar 31, 2005 8:17 pm

10,000 dogfights? heh, still a rookie, I have something like 150,000 kills, what a waste of time.

And moving predictibly is the same as standing still in my book.

Sirius · Post by **Sirius** » Fri Apr 01, 2005 4:00 am

Heh.

That's pretty well insane... even if I'd been playing Descent 2 at the same hyper rate I did for the first six months or so I don't think I'd have close to that many. 50,000? Probably, but...

SuzyQ · Post by **SuzyQ** » Fri Apr 01, 2005 6:45 am

I have played Buck many time, good player stays to the end live or die. 20-2 against Buck (HUMMMMMMM) something just wasn't right.

TheCops · Post by **TheCops** » Fri Apr 01, 2005 7:03 am

anyone can make their pilot name "Buck" or "Krom" or "LustBucket" or "Whatever". who knows who it was?

Clayman · Post by **Clayman** » Fri Apr 01, 2005 8:38 pm

If they flew as "Krom" it wouldn't be him anyway, he hasn't used that alias in years.

CDN_Merlin · Post by **CDN_Merlin** » Fri Apr 01, 2005 9:21 pm

SuzyQ wrote:I have played Buck many time, good player stays to the end live or die. 20-2 against Buck (HUMMMMMMM) something just wasn't right.

Accusing?

kurupt · Post by **kurupt** » Fri Apr 01, 2005 9:51 pm

unfortunately in this day and age of gaming lothar, it is an accusation 99% of the time. i remember in the good old days when nobody called you a hack without concrete evidence

Sirian · Post by **Sirian** » Sat Apr 02, 2005 1:32 am

I wish I could say I remember those days, but I can't.

I think I got accused of hacking three times in my first week on Kali.

"The good old days" are usually somebody's rosy or selective memory in play. A lot of days were good, but none of them were paradise.

- Sirian

CDN_Merlin · Post by **CDN_Merlin** » Sat Apr 02, 2005 2:14 am

I used to be accused of cheating when D3 first came out cause I would eat a mega and survive. Try explaining "loss" to a internet newbie. Got me banned from many user started servers.

Pun · Post by **Pun** » Sat Apr 02, 2005 9:11 am

Clayman wrote:If they flew as "Krom" it wouldn't be him anyway, he hasn't used that alias in years.

Yeah, we all know Krom flies as "Bettina" now.

Krom · Post by **Krom** » Sat Apr 02, 2005 10:00 am

Caught.

But that's ok, we all know you fly as spacegirl Pun.

Sirian wrote:I wish I could say I remember those days, but I can't.

I think I got accused of hacking three times in my first week on Kali.

"The good old days" are usually somebody's rosy or selective memory in play. A lot of days were good, but none of them were paradise.

- Sirian

The good old days to me were when 60+ players were playing even at odd hours during the day in more diverse levels then they play now. When I could move from server to server and normally only get called a hack once or twice a week.

Pun · Post by **Pun** » Sat Apr 02, 2005 1:43 pm

Krom wrote:Caught. But that's ok, we all know you fly as spacegirl Pun.

Curses! Foiled again!

I miss the D3TL matches. Back when you could get in a good server with skilled pilots and your team was a well oiled machine. The close ones were always the best. Win by one or two points. Let go of the stick and your knuckles creaked when they opened. Adrenaline surge city. Ahh, the good old days... Nowadays it's a bunch of laggers and tweakers. Pity.

Tigeron · Post by **Tigeron** » Wed Apr 06, 2005 8:24 am

AAHHH......15-0, 20-1...why that is normal when I play a 1 on 1. And no, I am not the 15 or the 20. Just because I cant get the kills up does not mean the other is cheating. I fly pretty good but just can't shoot worth a darn...It takes a pilot to be good a both to get your score up.

I was in a game some time ago where I would hit the other guy with a mega and he would not die. Yes he died 1 or 2 times over several games so he could be killed. But when I hit him in one game with 3 megas and he would not die I had to give up playing him at the time. He was above cheating so that only left lag/loss. We were both on dsl and had good pings but anyone who has been on Kali for any length of time knows that strange things happen for no apparent reason.

So before accusing anyone of cheating concider all the other possibilities first. if a person is going to cheat, they are not going to do it just one time. They will be doing it routinely and word will get around. At that time you can question if they are cheating but not before. It is not a good practice to cheat nor is it a good practice to accuse another of cheating right off the bat. I would have to say that most pilots are above cheating so give them the benifit of the doubt.

What does irk me to no end is when two of you spawn one right after the other at the same spawn point...... You are both going down a tunnel to get where the fighting is....

the pilot behind you all of a sudden clobbers you with missile and laser fire right up your afterburnner......

or you are following the other pilot down the tunnel after spawning one after another and all of a sudden he turns around and puts a missile up your nose.

Yes the tactic will give the other pilot a legal kill but IMHO....it is not good game play. I think that both should continue down that tunnel without firing at each other until you can split up and meet again, then battle it out. But then that is my perspective of what is good game play and many will not share that view...that's ok also as they have that right.

When I enter a game I do not see Gambit, Bluedevil, Orangepeel, etc. I only see blue, Green, Red, Yellow, Orange, Purple. That is until a pilot does something that really brings my attention to who is this nut that is doing this thing. I will pick that sucker out for the rest of the game and if I have a choice....I will go after him or her, with a vengance even with laser 1 and no missiles against their gauss and smarts. I will more than likely die but I can reduce his shields so another has a much easier chance for a kill.

The pilots that must get those kill points above all else and at any cost are the ones that seem to give the most trouble in what I concider good game play. Kill points are good as they show a certin amount of skill that has been aquired. But what good is a kill that was not done on equal ground. Yes you got the kill and others can see how good you must be....but....are you really that good?

I usually don't pursue this practice unless it happens more than one time in a game. And I only pursue this practice for the game duration. Next game is a new game and everyone starts clean again in my book. Some will dissagree with my practice or thinking, but others will agree with me right down the line.

I have had others that camp at a spawn point with there gauss and nail me time after time when I respawn. That is about the only time that I will do a so called respawn kill when I observe this nut respawning. But again only carry this out for the duration of the game.

What is fare in a game to one in their mind is not always fare to another in their mind. You will always have a conflict in this area of game play. So don't complain to much and just do the best you can. If you don't like the way someone plays then wait for another game to start or start one yourself.

We are all here to have fun and must acknowledge that sometimes we will have to put up with some things that are not quite right in our minds. Not much else you can do if you want to continue to fly and have fun doing it.

Now you all have a nice day, fire up your pyros and get your weapons loaded. I will meet you in the mines and can show you how to die with pride.

WarAdvocat · Post by **WarAdvocat** » Wed Apr 06, 2005 8:36 am

I got called a hack last night. It was really funny

Zero! · Post by **Zero!** » Wed Apr 06, 2005 4:58 pm

i called u a hacker, and no it wasnt funny u damn cheater.

Grendel · Post by **Grendel** » Wed Apr 06, 2005 6:48 pm

WarAdvocat wrote:I got called a hack last night. It was really funny

What game ? WoW ?

Clayman · Post by **Clayman** » Wed Apr 06, 2005 7:49 pm

Yes the tactic will give the other pilot a legal kill but IMHO....it is not good game play. I think that both should continue down that tunnel without firing at each other until you can split up and meet again, then battle it out. But then that is my perspective of what is good game play and many will not share that view...that's ok also as they have that right.

As soon as you spawn, you are a target. You have 2 full seconds of invulnerability, and start out immediately with missiles and lasers - you are expected to use them if you need to. No one calls time out in the middle of play in any normal sports game to collect themselves. If you didn't come in ready to play, don't come in. I'm not singling you out, but over the years so many pilots have espoused the "no spawn killing" view that it just got tiring.

Krom · Post by **Krom** » Wed Apr 06, 2005 8:26 pm

Spawn kills: You spawn, kill someone with the concussion missiles and lasers, take the spew and continue to kill that person repeatedly...

Bet51987 · Post by **Bet51987** » Thu Apr 07, 2005 4:42 pm

punisher wrote:
Clayman wrote:If they flew as "Krom" it wouldn't be him anyway, he hasn't used that alias in years.
Yeah, we all know Krom flies as "Bettina" now.

He plays that bad?

Bettina

Beowulf · Post by **Beowulf** » Thu Apr 07, 2005 6:18 pm

I miss the days of the D3tl when teams didn't "boycott" other teams. Boycotting killed competitive Descent play. High ranking teams stopped playing certain other high ranking teams, so the high ranking teams beat the hell out of newer, less talented teams over and over, they get discouraged because all they're playing is the elites, and they quit, then the boycotters didn't have anyone to play because the newbs left, so they went inactive. Hence the D3tl today.

ROX and RIP killed D3. There are some other teams out there who boycotted too, but not nearly as bad as those two.

I miss playing D1 and D2 on Kali, playing earthshaker and playing athena and vamped. I miss when people had fun.

El Ka Bong · Post by **El Ka Bong** » Thu Apr 07, 2005 9:39 pm

Good Ol' Amateur's Arena .. ! I peed my Pyro Diapers in there many a night when I was Just a Noob.. ! Especially once I figured how to get 200% sheilds.. !

...sometimes,I'll let a curious or whining noob just blow me up. I try to demonstrate the lag, by taking or trying to take hits ... I'll roll over and show the Belly of my Tank .. see if they can get me there. .. But then my "attitude" will be 'No Mercy', and anything is "fair" ... ! Eat my Respawn spew and give me your sheilds !!!

I'm and Experienced Pilot, ... very experienced at blowing up, sucking up lag, ... and respawning again and again and again .. noobs need to practice that too ! In every Descent level that is offered..

.. btw .. there are how many "new" players these days, .. just wondering who'd have a count ..? I remember when Bettina was a Noob... Now look what happened to her !@..