DescentBB

Why is there such a bru haa haa going on about Bush's statement that he'd bring the army in to control a flu pandemic if it hit America? What are people scared of? Is there any other body within a developed nation that is disciplined and organised enough to cope with such a situation? (here i'm talking about any country not just the USA)...erm..i don't think so.

For once i reckon he's right.

No one listens. Whatever.

Before it hits (and it will before the year ends...), learn how to cure yourself.

And all the people that were complaining that Bush didn't send enough military support to help out with the Katrina rescue effort turn around and say "hey!"...

[edit]And Sky edits his post so that mine seems reactionary and out-of-place. Let it be known that he said that Bush would use this as an excuse to extend the military's control over local police and put us close to martial law. All hail the revisionist edit button![/edit]

Hey!

So, Sky, would you rather have the country descend into anarchy if (God forbid) a major outbreak of bird flu did occur here? Or does your distrust of the federal government come first for you? I absolutely resent being called "dumb" just because I don't believe that Bush has intentions of becoming the world's next Hitler. I know you mean well, but for God's sake, take off your tinfoil hat once in a while and just use some common sense. As for that link you posted about curing yourself, I smell pseudoscientific BS there. Last time I checked, either getting immunized beforehand or getting put on major antivirals during is the best way to get through an illness like that.

Top Gun wrote: ....would you rather have the country descend into anarchy if (God forbid) a major outbreak of bird flu did occur here?

That is the question. That is the point. It will happen sooner rather than later and i'd rather have someone in charge that knows what they're doing overseeing isolation and quarantine than untrained bureaucrats peering over their desk tops.

i honestly never understood what was such a big deal about bird flu. but then it was brought to my attention that the black death (iirc) was originally a bird flu that migrated to humans.

so this current bird flu, if it can mutate to be able to transmit human to human (which atm thankfully it can't) is a big deal. like... BLACK DEATH big deal!

in australia the top-wigs are pretty worried about this.

Iceman wrote:Hey!

ROFLOL!!

roid wrote:i honestly never understood what was such a big deal about bird flu. but then it was brought to my attention that the black death (iirc) was originally a bird flu that migrated to humans.

so this current bird flu, if it can mutate to be able to transmit human to human (which atm thankfully it can't) is a big deal. like... BLACK DEATH big deal!

in australia the top-wigs are pretty worried about this.

That was the great pandemic around the turn of the century that killed some 30 million people world wide. and yes Roidy, I heard too that it was caused by a bird flu jumping over to humans. Everybody should be taking this modern day bird flu quite seriously.

The Black Death came in three forms, the bubonic, pneumonic, and septicemic. Each different form of plague killed people in a vicious way. All forms were caused by a bacterium called Yersinia pestis.

read more here
Plague is bacterial. Flu is a virus.

roid wrote:i honestly never understood what was such a big deal about bird flu. but then it was brought to my attention that the black death (iirc) was originally a bird flu that migrated to humans.

You're mixing up things here. Black Death aka The Plague killed a lot of europes population around 1350.

You're thinking "Spanish Flu". Scientist looking into the Spanish Flu recently found out that it was (ah -- is. The idiots recreated that virus) a mutated Avian Flu virus strain. That one killed approx. 40 million people in ~1918. Problems are that humans have no initial defense against H5N1 since there are no human viruses around that are related to it. It takes the immune system approx. 5 days to "learn" a new virus, unfortunately H5N1 kills you in 2-4 days. Plus viruses are usually highly contagious.

that's the one

http://edition.cnn.com/2005/HEALTH/cond ... index.html

You know i wonder if all this bird-flu/pandemic/panic/death talk is suddenly a hot topic in the media 'cause they're bored with Iraq and hurricanes; or somone knows somthing that us plebs don't.

I'm all for bird flu.

Something needs to dampen the population a bit.

Hell, the earth can afford to easily lose 2 billion people.

Keep in mind, it's most likely that bird flu (which is not transmissible between humans) will wreak havoc in developing nations, leaving the first world virtually untouched.

Mobius wrote:I'm all for bird flu.

Something needs to dampen the population a bit.

Hell, the earth can afford to easily lose 2 billion people.

Keep in mind, it's most likely that bird flu (which is not transmissible between humans) will wreak havoc in developing nations, leaving the first world virtually untouched.

Thus says the world's greatest humanitarian

TopGun, Mobius is not a Humanitrian. and he doesn't even read threads completely.

Guess you missed the implication of sarcasm that my smiley was meant to provide, then

ah

Flabby Chick wrote:http://edition.cnn.com/2005/HEALTH/cond ... index.html

You know i wonder if all this bird-flu/pandemic/panic/death talk is suddenly a hot topic in the media 'cause they're bored with Iraq and hurricanes; or somone knows somthing that us plebs don't.

The topic is hot because they can talk about how many people may die...whether the numbers are realistic or not...just like in New Orleans.

Skyalmian wrote:No one listens. Whatever.

Before it hits (and it will before the year ends...), learn how to cure yourself.

You believe this Malarkey?

WarAdvocat wrote:You believe this Malarkey?

I find it funny that people will blindly believe in a "God" but cannot and will not believe in themselves. Pitiful.

Those that will do that, will do that, and those that will not, will not. No one has anything to lose in trying, but everything to gain from it. If you want to take your chance with a flu vaccine that contains a preservative that happens to be 50% mercury, then so be it.

I believe in verifiable scientific experimentation and empirical research that has undergone the peer-review process. I don't believe blindly. My faith is rewarded by miracles every day. I cook with microwaves, I am transported by internal combustion engines, I bathe in electrically heated water. So, that's pretty much my religion.

If you get results from what I termed "malarkey", more power to you. Heck, I'll even concede that self-hypnosis is a very powerful tool...But show us something besides anecdotal evidence and a website with "free" tutorials that leads you through the donation gauntlet for 30 minutes before you get to the meat of the subject.

Well, to get back on topic I think what many people are afraid of Flabby is the potential for abuse of the 1st, 3rd, 4th, 5th, 9th, and 10th Amendments. They are as follows (emphasis mine):

1ST
Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the Government for a redress of grievances.

3rd
No Soldier shall, in time of peace be quartered in any house, without the consent of the Owner, nor in time of war, but in a manner to be prescribed by law.

4th
The right of the people to be secure in their persons, houses, papers, and effects, against unreasonable searches and seizures, shall not be violated, and no Warrants shall issue, but upon probable cause, supported by Oath or affirmation, and particularly describing the place to be searched, and the persons or things to be seized.

5th
No person shall be held to answer for a capital, or otherwise infamous crime, unless on a presentment or indictment of a Grand Jury, except in cases arising in the land or naval forces, or in the Militia, when in actual service in time of War or public danger; nor shall any person be subject for the same offence to be twice put in jeopardy of life or limb; nor shall be compelled in any criminal case to be a witness against himself, nor be deprived of life, liberty, or property, without due process of law; nor shall private property be taken for public use, without just compensation.

9th
The enumeration in the Constitution, of certain rights, shall not be construed to deny or disparage others retained by the people.

10th
The powers not delegated to the United States by the Constitution, nor prohibited by it to the States, are reserved to the States respectively, or to the people.

In theory, the People are supposed to have the power, not the Federal government. The Federal government is really only supposed to secure national security and trade. There are those in the US that feel that the Feds have been overstepping their constitutional authority for decades now. While I donâ??t necessarily disagree with them, I am not going to take a position one way or the other here.

Getting back to the bolded sections of the amendments above, there have been some pretty serious violations (in the eyes of many) recently. I will go in order.

1st or abridging the freedom of speech
During the last election cycle, the Republicans (and maybe the Democrats too, Iâ??m not sure) kept protestors away from the convention. The argument being that if you tell a demonstrator when and where he can demonstrate he really doesnâ??t have freedom of speech.

5th nor be deprived of life, liberty, or property, without due process of law; nor shall private property be taken for public use, without just compensation.
The Supreme Courts recent decision to let a Wal-Mart take land through emanate domain was seen by many as a slap in the face and in direct and open violation of the spirit of the 5th amendment.

9thThe enumeration in the Constitution, of certain rights, shall not be construed to deny or disparage others retained by the people.
I canâ??t think of any specific instance of a direct violation of the 9th (although I am sure others can and will be happy to point them out), but there is a growing feeling in this country that the Feds are grasping more power from â??The People.â?