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Spy agency faked key Vietnam War data
Posted: Thu Nov 03, 2005 1:22 am
by roid
http://telegraph.co.uk/news/main.jhtml? ... world.html
Spy agency faked key Vietnam War data
By Francis Harris
(Filed: 01/11/2005)
One of America's spy agencies faked key intelligence used to justify its intervention in the
Vietnam War, it was disclosed yesterday.
But the revelation was kept secret by the National Security Agency, partly because of fears
that it would boost criticism of the intelligence services over the war in Iraq.
According to material uncovered by the NSA's own historian, Robert Hanyok, middle-ranking
officers altered material relating to the Gulf of Tonkin incident.
Two US destroyers, Maddox and Turner Joy, were attacked by North Vietnamese craft in the
gulf on Aug 2 1964.
Two days later, amid bad weather and considerable confusion in the US chain of command,
Maddox reported that she had been fired on a second time.
Although its commander soon cast doubt on the reports, signals intelligence reported that
the North Vietnamese admitted "we sacrificed two ships".
In revenge President Lyndon Johnson ordered air raids against North Vietnamese naval facilities
and Congress authorised "all necessary steps including the use of armed force" to defend South
Vietnam.
But Mr Hanyok found that timings on key intelligence intercepts had been changed and the
"two ships" probably referred to the loss of two sailors in the first attack.
He blamed middle-ranking staff who realised the NSA's mistakes almost immediately but
covered them up, not for political reasons, but to hide the original mistakes.
At the time, senior administration officials cited the faked paperwork in testimony before
Congress.
It has even been suggested that President Johnson was so keen to deploy troops that he
fabricated the whole episode. More than 58,000 Americans and a million Vietnamese died
in the ensuing conflict.
O_O
Posted: Thu Nov 03, 2005 8:54 am
by Iceman
I swear that LBJ will go down in the history books as the worst president in history.
Posted: Thu Nov 03, 2005 9:35 am
by Duper
well . who do you think killed Kennedy?
Posted: Thu Nov 03, 2005 9:45 am
by Couver_
Duper wrote:well . who do you think killed Kennedy?
The guy who pulled the trigger
*putting the Captain Obvious costum away for another day
Posted: Thu Nov 03, 2005 10:05 am
by Iceman
Duper wrote:well . who do you think killed Kennedy?
LBJ and Castro of course.
Posted: Thu Nov 03, 2005 10:13 am
by woodchip
Ahh, the Gulf of Tonkin affair. Umm...Ice, Jimmy Carter will go down as the worst president evah.
Posted: Thu Nov 03, 2005 10:21 am
by Zuruck
Maybe worst presidents of our era. I'm sure there were a couple back in the day that really didn't do anything. What about McKinley? He was an early Bush, you know, all corporate interests, inept, piece of shat advisor Hanna...
Posted: Thu Nov 03, 2005 4:12 pm
by Behemoth
Duper wrote:well . who do you think killed Kennedy?
Watch the original abraham zapruder films and youll see both shots, the second being from the driver.
Posted: Thu Nov 03, 2005 10:10 pm
by CUDA
old news I knew about this when I served in the Navy in 1978. I actually had a buddy that served on the Turner Joy
Posted: Fri Nov 04, 2005 8:59 am
by Iceman
woodchip wrote:Ahh, the Gulf of Tonkin affair. Umm...Ice, Jimmy Carter will go down as the worst president evah.
Nope. Although he absolutely sucked as a president he at least cared about people and didn't send 54,000 kids off to their death to support his power habit.
Posted: Fri Nov 04, 2005 9:04 am
by Zuruck
Yah, I really don't think Jimmy Carter was cold enough to be president. Best example, look what he's done after his presidency, Habitat for Humanity. While most presidents end their days doing speeches for greenbacks, he actually cares about using his fame and power for good. He never had that edge that politicians need. It's almost as if, he was too nice.
Posted: Fri Nov 04, 2005 1:16 pm
by woodchip
Iceman wrote:woodchip wrote:Ahh, the Gulf of Tonkin affair. Umm...Ice, Jimmy Carter will go down as the worst president evah.
Nope. Although he absolutely sucked as a president he at least cared about people and didn't send 54,000 kids off to their death to support his power habit.
Hang on now Iceman. It was Kennedy who started the ball rolling in Vietnam. The 54,000 deaths were spread between JFK, LBJ and RMN. Carter presided over 18% inflation that ruined... how many people? What was the aftermath of the take over of our embassy in Iran and the inept "nice guy" way Carter handled that. Embolding how many terrorist acts down through the years. Notice how no embassy or foreign apartments have been bombed?
Point is how one responds to terrorism determines how things flow on down the line. Carter did nothing. Reagan during his stump for the presidence office made it quite clear what he would be doing if the Iran hostages were not released. Notice how quick they were released when Reagan won the vote? A super power cannot show weakness when targeted by terrorists. Which is why Bush will go down as a great president